Pan-european Celica Meeting

Posts written by Wolf_Tm

view post Posted: 4/4/2020, 18:01     PECM 2018: pics and vids!! - PECM 2018 - SLOVAKIA
Thanks Karolis,
let us organize the next one as soon as we can!
view post Posted: 9/7/2017, 09:55     The Program - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
Unfortunately pecm 2017 was canceled by the Organizers because they didn't meet their minimum number of participants. See you in Slovakia 2018.
view post Posted: 9/7/2017, 09:54     Registration (detailed program) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
Unfortunately pecm 2017 was canceled by the Organizers because they didn't meet their minimum number of participants. See you in Slovakia 2018.
view post Posted: 9/7/2017, 09:54     New information (price) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
Hi All,
Unfortunately pecm 2017 was canceled by the Organizers because they didn't meet their minimum number of participants. See you in Slovakia 2018.
view post Posted: 19/3/2017, 20:05     DNA of PECM: - PECM: Where, When and What
CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 19/3/2017, 14:00) 
CITAZIONE (Wolf_Tm250 @ 19/3/2017, 11:12) 
I agree with everything EXCEPT "variability" point.
While it is ok to have optional track, because non-trackers will still be "at the track" and living the track with the rest of the crew,
there is the need for the Meeting Organizers to have homogeneus room and board.
So it is ok the tenting option ONLY IF it's in the same accomodation place (for example at Como Lake we got camping, bungalows and rooms in the same structure), because i think the meeting goal should be to keep the participants "living the same experiences" and not making isolated groups.

I am glad you understand variability in terms of entertainment is necesery . It is very un-respectful to ask the same money from driver and non-driver for "the car day" (day in cars). In terms of accommodation is variability bad - agree. Main goal is to keep people together. There is one constraint (or condition): organizers must have B&S (BRAIN to decide right price range & SKILLS to find accommodation in that range). Else we all end up in the most luxury (and expensive) hotel in town just because it is easy to find and always empty.

Just to make it more clear, anyway, I didn't mean the track to be absolutely necessary... only that it should be optional when present...
As you know sometimes for many reasons (track too expensive - in 2007 Monza asked me 9000€ and Mugello 50000€ - or track too far from meeting location, for example) you can't have a track, so in this case it is still a good option to have a good mountain road to drive with our cars...
view post Posted: 19/3/2017, 11:12     DNA of PECM: - PECM: Where, When and What
MY OPINIONS about PECM DNA, waiting for all opinions...


CITAZIONE
When having PECM - every two years (clear), exact date is in meeting organizer's hands

IF in Central Europe, so shorter trips to, and IF high sponsored/supported event, that is to say cheaper for members, I think that, sometimes, it could even be yearly.




CITAZIONE
Where having PECM - should it be anywhere? Nicosia? Moscow? Lisboa? that's the question and if not why?

YES, anywhere.
Even if peripheral meetings will mainly get people from the neighboring countries, I think that any country of Europe (not fucking European Union, but EUROPE) should make at least one PECM.



CITAZIONE
a) get as much as possible Celica people together?
b) get in the first place "core" participants together (with Celica or not) + few Celica newcomers?
c) make in fact local/national Celica meeting (local habits, local style) with international guests?

It's enough to get neighboring countries participants.
Some of them will become part of the "PECM core" in the next ones even if farther away PECM




CITAZIONE
what makes PECM?
Important question. Is there anything what common meet of few cars turn into PECM? I mean... if Celica drivers from Switzerland, Germany, Austria and Czech Republic meet ... is that PECM? Or it is just GT-four drivers club meeting? (sorry Stefano for using your club as an example :)).

PECM DNA is that Celica participants will drive through Europe to get to Meetings organized every two year (or even yearly) each time in a different country.
That's why it can't be a meeting organized any time by the same group in the same Country.



CITAZIONE

I believe it is structure of event and program. When someone say "PECM" it immediately gives impression how it looks.

For example:
[size=1]
day#1 (afternoon arrival)
dinner together
accomodation

day #2 (car day)
ANY KIND OF CAR EVENT
dinner together
accommodation

day #3 (entertaiment day)
ANY KIND OF FUN (road trip, interesting local place visit, non car activities)
lunch together
dinner togehther
accomodation

day #4 (forenoon departure)

is this makes any sense?

Yes, I agree





CITAZIONE
PECM traditions
After 10 years that seems to be some "traditions" and I believe it is nice to identify it:

photo together
To have stunning picture of all cars is simply amazing. I remember first time this started in Greece (pit stop photo), in Poland tuned to perfection and in Riga? No one can beat epic picture they managed there!

t-shirt
No fashion miracle ;) but nice thing to remember.

sticker
Jevgenij from Moscow started this in Italy 2007 (made stickers and gave to all for free). He had no idea what he has started :).

variability
From the beginning there was always chance to choose. Not everyone has the same budget, some travels thousands miles to get there. That is why in 2007 was race track optional (100€ counts). I remember folks from UK tenting (not using hotel), the same Greece, Poland... (to race or not). In Riga we had chance to choose of style of entertainment. Some people were participated only first day (local mostly) and last year the same. Every time there was a chance to choose own style. Also I remember not both days had the same amount of participants.

I agree with everything EXCEPT "variability" point.
While it is ok to have optional track, because non-trackers will still be "at the track" and living the track with the rest of the crew,
there is the need for the Meeting Organizers to have homogeneus room and board.
So it is ok the tenting option ONLY IF it's in the same accomodation place (for example at Como Lake we got camping, bungalows and rooms in the same structure), because i think the meeting goal should be to keep the participants "living the same experiences" and not making isolated groups.
view post Posted: 15/3/2017, 10:44     DNA of PECM: - PECM: Where, When and What
What is the Pan European Celica Meeting?

I think that the main goal is to get togheter people with the same Celica passion from all over the European continent...


CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 14/3/2017, 09:14) 
Exactly. PECM is about get people together. That's main "DNA of PECM" events. Who cares about unlimited food, resting tents, given watter, 4 star hotel etc... WHO CARES! See your own program. That is inspiration for clean participant friendly event. Is this what they do? Not even for a second! They do NOT care about people and getting them together. They have another priorities - obvious once. You will see there will be no significant drop in price to show they respect the voice of the people. People who already participated already on PECMs. People you know in person (not unknown faces).

Personally I won't be so severe...
I do think that PECM is about "get people Celica togheter", but I'm pretty sure that each of us (so including also you) would decline the "staying togheter" in a different way mainly for personal cultural background and country of origin of the organizer... and that's the good thing, as in this way any PECM will be different from the other. ;)

About the Hotel, the Food, the Entertainment choose and the Prices, "unfortunately or luckily" these are up to the organizing Club... it was always in this way and must be so...
and, as I already wrote, the organizing Club will pay for its choices in terms of number of participants...

CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 15/3/2017, 06:52) 
Wolf,
you are mixing two things together in you speak and core of this debate si loosing it's edge. That is wrong. It is like answering my question "I do not want bankers taking our money for nothing" with "it's their business and cultural difference is good". Sure it's main goal of bankers to make money on people and I have nothing against cultural difference but this is not what we are talking about and it has nothing to do with the topic.

Martin, I think I'm not mixing things... and if you ask "I do not want bankers taking our money for nothing", I would just reply you "you are free not to use their money, use barter instead".

That is to say that as you are a long-term meeting organizer, you pretty know that it is IMPOSSIBLE and it is meaningless to listen for Participants' want and whims, as you would end up having NO meeting at all.
You pretty know that once someone, being you, a Club mate or whoever, decides to loose his time and money to make a meeting then Participants are just free to buy OR NOT the Meeting almost "sight unseen":
it is just mandatory to act in this way to have Meetings!

In the end, Martin, at this round, and per your want, as you were asked many times to make a CZ meet, we are just Participants!
So we need to let the Organizers make the Meeting.

And about your worry about them making money out of PECM... don't worry as Economic Law of Demand and Offer is blind, and will just decrease the number of Participants as the Price goes up.
view post Posted: 14/3/2017, 20:26     Registration (detailed program) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 14/3/2017, 09:14) 
CITAZIONE (Wolf_Tm250 @ 11/3/2017, 19:42) 
Martin,
you already know my answer... we had no other offer to organize the 2017 PECM, moreover you and Pavel were asked million times to organize a PECM, as first members of PECM,
and in my opinion is very important to keep the fire lit and carry on the tradition...
What I would hear from you is, instead, your plan for the PECM 2021 in that fantastic Winery near Brno... ;)

Wolf,
we have talked together many times about this. I told you CZ is not ready to organize good event yet + I have warned EXACTLY THIS will happen. More than a year ago!

Martin, let's wait AFTER the next PECM to judge how it was... ;)



CITAZIONE
How is that possible I knew? Also it's not true there was no option for PECM2017. Slovakia people were interested and still are for the future.

Yes, but SK option come out after CZ accepted with reservation to talk with the Club before confirmation...
Moreover SK was happy to attend another PECM before organizing one, because Italy 2015 was the first PECM for them...


CITAZIONE
CITAZIONE (Wolf_Tm250 @ 11/3/2017, 19:42) 
This said, I'm sure even this one will be a GREAT PECM:
it's not only about place/hotels/food, but mainly about Celica people getting togheter with the same passion...

Exactly. PECM is about get people together. That's main "DNA of PECM" events. Who cares about unlimited food, resting tents, given watter, 4 star hotel etc... WHO CARES! See your own program. That is inspiration for clean participant friendly event. Is this what they do? Not even for a second! They do NOT care about people and getting them together. They have another priorities - obvious once. You will see there will be no significant drop in price to show they respect the voice of the people. People who already participated already on PECMs. People you know in person (not unknown faces).

Personally I won't be so severe...
I do think that PECM is about "get people Celica togheter", but I'm pretty sure that each of us (so including also you) would decline the "staying togheter" in a different way mainly for personal cultural background and country of origin of the organizer... and that's the good thing, as in this way any PECM will be different from the other. ;)

About the Hotel, the Food, the Entertainment choose and the Prices, "unfortunately or luckily" these are up to the organizing Club... it was always in this way and must be so...
and, as I already wrote, the organizing Club will pay for its choices in terms of number of participants...

Edited by Wolf_Tm250 - 15/3/2017, 10:48
view post Posted: 12/3/2017, 20:04     Registration (detailed program) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
CITAZIONE (Urputus @ 11/3/2017, 20:48) 
CITAZIONE
What I would hear from you is, instead, your plan for the PECM 2021 in that fantastic Winery near Brno... ;)

Wolf,

guys from Hungary already expressed their interest to organize PECM 2021, but they will talk about it personally on PECM in Prague ;) . We think we have something to look forward to.

Regarding PECM 2017:
Thank you all for your interest. Many of you asked us to make another attempt to reduce the price and also are trying to help us (thank you for this). We decided to meet the suppliers in the next few days and try to find some solution with them.
Once we have some news, we will let you know though this forum.

We are looking forward to seeing you in Prague.

Ok, perfect idea!
And yes, I heard about Hungary too... let's see how it ends up!
view post Posted: 11/3/2017, 19:42     Registration (detailed program) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 11/3/2017, 09:35) 
I want price breakdown. Like you did for example.

I think he gave the price breakdown, so everything is fine for me from this point of view...


CITAZIONE
Last PECM participated 25 cars (give or take). When this will be 10... Will this help or damage PECM legacy?
Because of greed they bury whole idea "meet people from whole Europe". Just ask your self what is purpose of PECM and if they fulfilling it or not.

Martin,
you already know my answer... we had no other offer to organize the 2017 PECM, moreover you and Pavel were asked million times to organize a PECM, as first members of PECM,
and in my opinion is very important to keep the fire lit and carry on the tradition...
What I would hear from you is, instead, your plan for the PECM 2021 in that fantastic Winery near Brno... ;)

This said, I'm sure even this one will be a GREAT PECM:
it's not only about place/hotels/food, but mainly about Celica people getting togheter with the same passion...
view post Posted: 10/3/2017, 20:25     Registration (detailed program) - PECM 2017 - CZECH REPUBLIC
CITAZIONE (malpaso @ 9/3/2017, 15:26) 
why I see DOUBLE price? Why that jump? Probably because Czech Republic is 2x more expensive contry than Italy... Latvia and of course Poland (our neighbors)

Hi Martin,
I agree that this year PECM costs are higher than all the others PECM, and already talked with Pavel about this as well...
mainly because the higher the price, the less the people...
Anyway he and his club are doing this PECM in the way they think it would be a great meeting, so this year it's up to them to decide what to see, what to eat, which the trip, what the entertainment and accomodation and how much the price...
and they bet this is the best combo for us.
We will see how the meeting will be... ;)
290 replies since 18/3/2004